Well this weeks N54 trend and word of the day is "band-aid". I dont have much time today but i'm sure this thread will be a mess when i get back to reading it.
This is a debate between a properly built meth injection system vs a PI e85 injection system
First off when searching methanol vs ethanol you will come across 2 things that are mentioned in just about every comparison. 1. Meth is more poisonous
2. Meth has 67% the energy of 100% gas where as ethanol is 83%.
BTW. Both are alcohol based and both are poisonous in high concentrates.
Methanol is used in racing, theres even a class for it. Yes the engines are build and tuned different to handle the cooler burn and the added fuel but to everyone's surprise a 100% ethanol engine would be built the same.
So is there a distinguishable trait that makes 1 fuel less better than another besides needing more meth than eth?
They're anti Knock properties are about the same with the octane being close to equal (R+M)/2 112-115 (although true alcohol readings are not obtainable)
So now let put fuel to the side and look at systems.
99.5% of meth injection systems are put together cheap with poor design. On the contrary probably 99.9% of failures is due to poor system design.
If your just looking for a minor performance enhancer than sticking 2 smaller nozzles in the charge pipe is fine. When you start getting greedy and keep upsizing nozzles and cranking up the boost is when you run into issues. When you start using it to increase your fuel capacity the charge pipe just became the worst place to inject. Would anyone run their ethanol through their charge pipe to make up for fueling? I know Fuel-it is working on a TB injection system which perfectly fine because they are not advertising 1000HP through it. They have done a great job making it pretty conservative.
So lets face it, the only practical place to inject any type of secondary fuel whether its ethanol or methanol would be in the intake runner for each cylinder.
As most of you know (based off the amount of txt, PM's, phone calls, tagged posts i get) I run meth, I'm starting to think my nickname should be methhead. I love power, i'm no different than the next person. I have access to 1 gas station that carries E85 and now that my GF doesn't live 20 min from it, its now a 40 min drive. I'm stuck with pump 93 and methanol if i want to make any type of power with a ST. So i went out and designed a bullet proof system that has worked great. I did not invent something new here. I just implemented it on a platform that relies heavily on methanol.
For some reason when you start talking meth one of the first things people say is "what if a nozzle gets clogged?" I have no idea where this even came about. Was the first methanol injection systems mixed with sand and unfiltered? Meth out of a VP barrel is already extremely pure, 10 times more pure than anything you get out of a pump at a gas station. If you dont run a filter in any type of fueling system than you deserve to have problems. I run 3 which is 66% overkill. Not once have i even came close to this clogged nozzle BS.
A proper meth system has boost kill fail safes which i think most all do now. Todays controllers have a range so if there is leaks or a kinked line it kills boost. Basically if the flow isn't within the user specified range.
A proper system needs to utilize the following
IPW controller with solenoid
function of given fail safes
individual cyl nozzles
quality lines and hardware
remote tank
Built like you would build a factory fuel system.
Dont be stupid
Just about all problems are contributed to these.
Some methanol donts:
Progressive controllers
single point injection
CP location for added fuel.
window fluid tank
dyes
no filters
Most tuners dont mess with tuning meth injected cars for a bunch of good reasons. You dont know the condition its in, how well its working, blah blah blah. So for a tuner to take the responsibility in tuning something with that big of an unknown is dumb. If something shall happen the first person to always get blamed is the tuner.
Some references:
http://www.bimmerboost.com/showthrea...ice-discussion
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...ht=direct+port (@sticky If you dont want this link here let me know i'll delete it. Has to much stuff to copy over)
i have to end it here for now but please discuss.
This is a debate between a properly built meth injection system vs a PI e85 injection system
First off when searching methanol vs ethanol you will come across 2 things that are mentioned in just about every comparison. 1. Meth is more poisonous
2. Meth has 67% the energy of 100% gas where as ethanol is 83%.
BTW. Both are alcohol based and both are poisonous in high concentrates.
Methanol is used in racing, theres even a class for it. Yes the engines are build and tuned different to handle the cooler burn and the added fuel but to everyone's surprise a 100% ethanol engine would be built the same.
So is there a distinguishable trait that makes 1 fuel less better than another besides needing more meth than eth?
They're anti Knock properties are about the same with the octane being close to equal (R+M)/2 112-115 (although true alcohol readings are not obtainable)
So now let put fuel to the side and look at systems.
99.5% of meth injection systems are put together cheap with poor design. On the contrary probably 99.9% of failures is due to poor system design.
If your just looking for a minor performance enhancer than sticking 2 smaller nozzles in the charge pipe is fine. When you start getting greedy and keep upsizing nozzles and cranking up the boost is when you run into issues. When you start using it to increase your fuel capacity the charge pipe just became the worst place to inject. Would anyone run their ethanol through their charge pipe to make up for fueling? I know Fuel-it is working on a TB injection system which perfectly fine because they are not advertising 1000HP through it. They have done a great job making it pretty conservative.
So lets face it, the only practical place to inject any type of secondary fuel whether its ethanol or methanol would be in the intake runner for each cylinder.
As most of you know (based off the amount of txt, PM's, phone calls, tagged posts i get) I run meth, I'm starting to think my nickname should be methhead. I love power, i'm no different than the next person. I have access to 1 gas station that carries E85 and now that my GF doesn't live 20 min from it, its now a 40 min drive. I'm stuck with pump 93 and methanol if i want to make any type of power with a ST. So i went out and designed a bullet proof system that has worked great. I did not invent something new here. I just implemented it on a platform that relies heavily on methanol.
For some reason when you start talking meth one of the first things people say is "what if a nozzle gets clogged?" I have no idea where this even came about. Was the first methanol injection systems mixed with sand and unfiltered? Meth out of a VP barrel is already extremely pure, 10 times more pure than anything you get out of a pump at a gas station. If you dont run a filter in any type of fueling system than you deserve to have problems. I run 3 which is 66% overkill. Not once have i even came close to this clogged nozzle BS.
A proper meth system has boost kill fail safes which i think most all do now. Todays controllers have a range so if there is leaks or a kinked line it kills boost. Basically if the flow isn't within the user specified range.
A proper system needs to utilize the following
IPW controller with solenoid
function of given fail safes
individual cyl nozzles
quality lines and hardware
remote tank
Built like you would build a factory fuel system.
Dont be stupid
Just about all problems are contributed to these.
Some methanol donts:
Progressive controllers
single point injection
CP location for added fuel.
window fluid tank
dyes
no filters
Most tuners dont mess with tuning meth injected cars for a bunch of good reasons. You dont know the condition its in, how well its working, blah blah blah. So for a tuner to take the responsibility in tuning something with that big of an unknown is dumb. If something shall happen the first person to always get blamed is the tuner.
Some references:
http://www.bimmerboost.com/showthrea...ice-discussion
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...ht=direct+port (@sticky If you dont want this link here let me know i'll delete it. Has to much stuff to copy over)
i have to end it here for now but please discuss.